Transcript - 2GB Mornings with Mark Levy
MARK LEVY: Minister, good morning to you.
JASON CLARE, MINISTER FOR EDUCATION: Good morning, mate.
LEVY: Look, I know this is not easy to talk about, but it's an important conversation we need to have. And put simply, I mean, clearly, we've got a problem that needs to be addressed, Minister.
CLARE: Bang on. This is sickening stuff and it's serious. It demands serious action from the Federal Government and from state and territory governments. I know it's not easy to talk about, but we can't turn away here. It's too important. There are things that we've already done, but not enough and not fast enough. One of the reasons why, when Parliament comes back at the end of this month, I'll introduce legislation to cut off funding to centres that aren't up to scratch when it comes to safety and quality. This is the big weapon that the Federal Government can wield here. We fund child care centres. About 70 per cent of the funding to run them comes from taxpayers. And if they're repeatedly not meeting the sort of safety and quality standards we need, then you've got to have the power to cut the funding off.
LEVY: What was your reaction, Minister, when you heard about the allegations levelled against these two men, these two vile humans in Victoria? And to think back to the case and the allegations and the offences that he pleaded guilty to involving Ashley Griffith, Australia's worst paedophile. Did it make you sick like the rest of the country?
CLARE: It did. Of course it did. One of my friends is directly involved in this. One of my friends who lives in Victoria, her two girls are directly affected by this. She was one of the more than 1,000 parents the other day that got a notification saying that they need to get medical advice. You can imagine what she said to me, and I can't repeat it on the radio, but she's burning with rage and confusion about what she needs to do to keep her kids safe. I know how parents are feeling because they've told me. And it's not just what's happening in Victoria. I don't want to speak specifically about that case because it's before the court. But when that other mongrel was arrested in Queensland a couple of years ago, we commissioned a review into child safety across the country. It's the reason why we've taken action on mobile phones and mandatory reporting, but it's also the reason why we've got to do more here, whether it's a national register of workers in these centres or whether it's the sort of action that's been recommended by the former NSW Ombudsman last week around CCTV and more and better information for parents. The honest answer, mate, is the work here will never be done and there will always be bad people that will try to break through the net. But that doesn't mean that we don't have to take action and that we don't have to take action faster, because we do.
LEVY: I know you've said that you'll be moving legislation when the Parliament returns, but. And this is not a Labor versus Liberal thing, this is not a Labor versus Coalition thing, right? I'm just sitting here expressing the anger of so many people who are, who are writing to me and talking to me about this. We had a Royal Commission into institutional responses to child sexual abuse in 2015, 10 years ago. It made a number of recommendations, including a nationally consistent working with children scheme, something that includes a national register of individuals working with children, particularly in out of home care settings. Yet we've seen nothing, not from your Government, nor the former Coalition Government. So, do politicians and those elected officials. And look, you're the one that's got to front up and answer these tough questions today, but do you all need to put your hand up and say, look, we've been sitting on our hands for too long and we've allowed this system to deteriorate to a point where innocent, defenceless children are being preyed upon.
CLARE: You've got to cough up and say it's taken too bloody long. And that's what I have said repeatedly about this. And to be fair when we sit around the table as Education Ministers, Labor and Liberal, we all agree it's taken too bloody long, and we're determined to act here. I can give you a long answer about how complicated this is, but to be honest, people listening don't give a bugger about that. They don't want excuses, they want action. And I spoke to the Attorney-General about this the other day. The Attorney-Generals across the country are leading work on Working with Children Checks. She agrees. If she was on the program now, she'd say exactly the same thing. We need to fix the Working with Children Checks. We need to make sure that the information goes from state to state and that if somebody's criminal record changes, then it's updated. Don't think, though, that this is a silver bullet, because a lot of these mongrels you're talking about here got a Working with Children Check, because at the time they didn't have a criminal record. So, it's not the only thing that needs fixing here. There's a lot that needs to be done, but that's one of them.
LEVY: There is one thing, though, I want to challenge you on, Minister. And earlier this week you announced that taking photos and videos of children on personal phones and devices will be restricted by early childhood education centres who adopt the new National Model Code and guidelines, code that's now in place, but it's voluntary. Why is it voluntary?
CLARE: The ban was put into the National Code last year. Voluntary from July but will become mandatory this year. Again, you're not interested, and your listeners aren't interested in the convoluted process to make this system mandatory. But it goes into regulations in a couple of months. Most centres are already doing it. All centres need to do it. Because we are doing this for a reason. All of the advice from the cops and from the regulator is that we've got to get the phones and the personal devices out of these centres. The only photos that mums and dads should be getting at lunchtime from their centre should be from the centre issued phone or the centre issued camera.
LEVY. So, it will become mandatory.
CLARE: Yes.
LEVY: Good. That's good news. Because when I think about voluntary and you know, I've sat here, Minister, with respect, and I pointed to a Four Corners report recently and, you know, there were some horrifying examples of, you know, children being used as mops, babies being slapped, 3,000 babies and toddlers sent to hospital with injuries sustained in child care. Last year, more than 26,000 serious incidents reported. That's a 27 per cent increase over the last three years. And I thought there shouldn't be any voluntary nature about this, but it is going to be mandatory, well, that's a good thing. I wanted to ask you as well. And I know we're limited with time. There's a call today by Louise Edmunds, a founding of the Independent Collective of Survivors, to ban men from working in this sector. I disagree with that. I'd be interested in your response as the Minister.
CLARE: I don't think it's the solution. You just mentioned the Four Corners report. Go back and look at that footage. It's not men there, right? This is not just about blokes, it's about people that work in our centres. If you go back and look at whether it's the Royal Commission from 10 years ago or the child safety review that I kicked off, or the work that Chris Wheeler, the former Deputy Ombudsman, handed down last week, we know what we need to do. They're not recommending that. What they're saying is we need to toughen the penalties, improve the information for parents. Look at CCTV and the centres where they're not up to scratch; introduce new laws to cut off funding where centres aren't up to scratch; national register of all of the workers in this system because they move from state to state and fix the Working with Children Checks. They're the sorts of things that Education Ministers discussed last Friday when I got people together to talk about this. And that's the sort of work we've got to accelerate right now.
LEVY: All right, well, Minister, can I thank you for your strong comments this morning. We've got to follow those strong comments up with action, so you've got an open invitation. If there's any updates you want to provide to myself and my listeners, you just give us a ring and jump on and let us know. This is such an important issue. We're talking about innocent, defenceless children, babies. And I think there's a lot of parents listening to you today saying this is all well and good, but we need to follow it up. So, we're going to put it in your capable hands, and fingers crossed we can sort this out sooner rather than later because we don't need these grubs preying on our children. Thanks so much for joining us.
CLARE: Thanks, mate, I appreciate it.