Interview - Sky News

KIERAN GILBERT: In fact, let's go live back to Orange. Addressing the Bush Summit shortly is the Education Minister, Jason Clare. He joins us on the program. Thanks for your time. 
So, what's your message there to the Summit? When you speak, what do you want to see happening in the regional and remote areas when it comes to universities particularly?

JASON CLARE, MINISTER FOR EDUCATION: Well, the point I want to make today is that in a place like, say, Vaucluse on the harbour in Sydney, about 60 per cent of people who live there have a uni degree. But it's only about 25 per cent in Western Sydney where you and I grew up. And it's even less in a place like Orange, where we are today, it's about 20 per cent.

Now, that might have been okay when we were kids and we were growing up, but it's not going to be right for our kids as they grow up. You know, the fact is that about 50 per cent of new jobs being created right now require a uni degree and about 40 per cent require a TAFE qualification. So, as we build a better and a fairer education system, this is the sort of place where we've got to focus. This is where the payoff is.

GILBERT: You've been copping a bit of fire and some friendly fire from the Treasurer in Victoria. For example, Tim Pallas. You've been accused of damaging one of our most important exports in international education by capping the number of foreign students. What do you say to that critique and that criticism, as I say, that you've been copping from some Labor figures?

CLARE: Yeah, a bit of strong language. I guess the fact is that with the caps, with the changes that we're proposing, it'll mean for a state like Victoria that the total number of students that can be enrolled in universities in Victoria next year will be about 1 per cent lower than could be enrolled or were enrolled last year. So, that, I think, gives it a little bit of perspective. International education is important. Makes our unis money, but also makes our economy money. More than that, it helps make us friends. We've talked about this before, mate. When students come here, they fall in love with the country, they go home and they take that love and affection for Australia back home with them. But we need to make sure that we protect this sector from the crooks and the shonks who are trying to exploit it. There's been too much of that over the last few years and we've got to protect community support for it. And that's what these reforms are about, making sure that we do it in a better and a fairer way so that it's not just a couple of universities that benefit from it, but more universities that can benefit from it.

GILBERT: International students will, according to the Group of Eight representative, Vicki Thomson. She says they're going to look at this now, see the cap and go, okay, well, if there's a cap, I'll look elsewhere. She argues it's going to damage the sector.

CLARE: This is an important sector. We want students to come here and study. There's effectively a cap right now, Kieran. There's a de facto cap that exists right now. It's called Ministerial Direction 107, that's throttling the system. It's a pretty blunt instrument that over the last six months or so, has meant that more students have been enrolled in the Group of Eight universities. But it's really hit hard a lot of smaller regional universities. What we're doing with these changes, it'll mean, say for the Group of Eight universities, that the number of students that they can enrol next year will be about one 1.9 per cent less than they enrolled last year. And no one was making the complaint last year that this was some sort of catastrophic event. So, a bit of perspective here. And what it will mean is that we can help those regional universities that have been affected by Ministerial Direction 107 make sure that they can benefit from international education as well.

You know, a place like Charles Sturt University that's got a campus here in Orange. Before the pandemic, they were educating about 2000 students were commencing each year, the pandemic kneecapped that, put them down to a couple of hundred. Ministerial Direction 107 has had a similar effect. The cap we're providing for them is 1000. So, this argument that we're forcing students from the city to the bush isn't right. The fact is, students do want to come and study at regional universities like this, and this cap is a better and a fairer way to do it.

GILBERT: Now, on the role of government intervening in this sector, is this the place for government? Should government be really putting caps on private institutions?

CLARE: Well, the Federal Government is responsible for migration, and I make no apologies for the fact that government has a role here. We've said that we want to restore migration levels to pre-pandemic levels, and this is part of that. What it will mean is that the number of international students that enrol in our universities next year will be roughly the same as 2023 levels. But international education isn't just unis. People come here and study at private vocational providers as well. So, across the board, what this means is that the number of people from overseas who come here and study at our international education providers, be they unis or VET providers, next year, will be about the same number as there were before the pandemic in 2019.

GILBERT: Just on another matter, the former National Security Adviser to the Prime Minister, Justin Bassi, he said yesterday that anyone who has any sympathies to Hamas should not be allowed to Australia. Do you agree with that assessment?

CLARE: I don't think anybody that's coming has any sympathy for Hamas. We've condemned the actions of Hamas on October 7. I think any reasonable person would. I've met a lot of the people from Palestine that have come here over the last nine months. These are people basically had their home blown up, in some cases, had their family killed. They're coming here, you know, trying to rebuild their lives. 
Often these are people who are doctors, who are nurses, who are dentists, who are engineers, people who can make a great contribution to this country. And, you know, I said this the other day, I encourage Peter Dutton, I encourage members of the Coalition to come to my electorate, meet some of the people who've come here from Palestine. I think it might change their view.

GILBERT: And yep. In terms of - yep, you've met many. But are you reassured that by the agencies that the appropriate checks are there because, you know, they're coming out of a war zone where Hamas is in control?

CLARE: But it's not just checked by our agencies. Kieran, think about it. They're also checked by the Israeli agencies and the Egyptian agencies. Do you think Israel wants to let out somebody who might be a Hamas fighter or a Hamas sympathiser? They want to get them. So, it's not in their interest either.

GILBERT: Jason Clare, joining us from the Bush Summit in Orange. Thanks so much.